Author Topic: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race  (Read 259415 times)

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #150 on: February 25, 2018, 12:45:57 AM »
Unfortunately, I'm not the product testing specialist, but if you have special questions, I'll try to answer them.
I usually paddle on the Danube river. In winter there is little traffic, in summer all the more. Motor boats for the Wakesurfer, cargo ships and cruise ships make some waves.
I am 195 cm tall and weighs about 92 kg, age 53. my balance is rather mediocre, as is my paddling.
The last few months I was paddling with a Starboard Allstar 14x24.5, which was well suited for the conditions. I also did not have to swim in some local races.

The Signature is a 14x24.75 and is in the first moment much tippier than the Allstar. However, the secondary stability seems a bit better. Still I lose speed immediately, as soon as it gets wavy and I notice the legs clearly after 8-10 km.
I was able to test the 2016 model for about 50km last summer, and thus managed my fastest time on the track.
My signature weighs just under 10 kg including the fin and paddles great. It's so light and stiff that you do not want to paddle anything else after some km.
I hope I am improving so far that I master the board even in races and do not go swimming or be too slow.

Sorry for my poor English, but google helps

How much faster than the allstar did you feel it was ?

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #151 on: February 25, 2018, 12:48:03 AM »
......However, it will be well suited to the upcoming ICF formats I was told about yesterday.
Ok, spill the beans!

Dull time trials would be much easier to train for, and to hold for the Olympics. Refereeing an Olympic event that was like the PPG/BOP with Kai/Connor etc knocking seven bells out of each other and buoys coming free from its moorings etc would be a nightmare.

The final format will be publicised from late March/April apparently. However, provisionally speaking, it’s looking like a 5km beach race, a long distance flatwater race and my own personal favourite, a sprint competition of a distance up to 1000m (I suspect around half of that going by their recent rule book).

photofr

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #152 on: February 25, 2018, 01:23:12 AM »
11.54 KM/H - not for 100 meters, not for 200 meters, but for an entire kilometer - that's pretty impressive in my books.

PHOTOS - Check... and thanks to you guys for sharing.
BOARD COMPARAISON - Pending
COMPETITIVE START FEEDBACK - Pending
OPEN WATER USE - Pending, but there are couple of cool photos of that board surfing

Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

mr_proper

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #153 on: February 25, 2018, 01:38:50 AM »

How much faster than the allstar did you feel it was ?

My fastest average speed with the Allstar on the home track (about 10 km; 1 km harbor, 4 km upstream, 4 km downstream, 1 km harbor) was 8.9 km/h.
With the Signature, which I did not know well, it was 9.3 km/h.
I think that 0.5 - 0.7 km/h higher average speed is realistic.
A paddle friend did the same course with an average of 9.7 km/h with the Signature.
SIC RS 14x23, 2018
SIC RS 14x26, 2018
Lightcorp Signature Race 14x24.75, 2018 (sold)
JP Australia AdventurAir 12x36, 2017
Starboard Allstar 14x24.5, 2017 (sold)
SIC Bullet 14x27.25 TWC, 2015
Jimmy Lewis Sidewinder 14x25, 2016 (sold)
Sprint 14x23, 2015 (sold)
JL Stiletto 14x28, 2014 (sold)

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #154 on: February 25, 2018, 01:44:26 AM »
I wonder if switching their fin out to a longer (but proven) performer like a black project Maliko might help tame it a little.

photofr

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #155 on: February 25, 2018, 02:27:47 AM »
@UKGM
That's exactly what I was thinking when I placed my order for the 14x23.

I started with a HUGE FIN on my needle nose / needle pin tail 17'6x23" - and thought I would only paddle with that fin on dead flat water.

- 3 months later, I went with the Maliko to test out Open Ocean on calmer days.
- about 9 months after getting the board, I was doing smaller downwind runs using the Tiger (a very fast fin, also from Black Project).

I am planning on using large fin surfaces should stability be out of this World - but for really rough conditions, I will still have my surfskis and/or my Ace. Only time will tell if large fins are really needed.

ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE
Here's a 42km upwind / sidewind / and stronger DW on the way back - with the pin tail using the Tiger fin.


« Last Edit: February 25, 2018, 02:31:01 AM by photofr »
Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

Area 10

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #156 on: February 25, 2018, 02:36:31 AM »
I wonder if switching their fin out to a longer (but proven) performer like a black project Maliko might help tame it a little.
A longer fin with more area at the tip will certainly help a bit. Although the BP Maliko would not be my choice. But you will also lose speed.

IMO the best way to go fast with a board like this is to make sure you are in clean water, and to have very good balance skills, and practice a lot. And use a small fin.

It is lovely to see a new design and construction appearing on these pages. Under 10kg is wonderful.

Now, if they’d only make a board that I could actually paddle, in the conditions I’d paddle, I’d buy one. But on this board I’d be literally faster on an 11ft surf board. However I appreciate that that is entirely my failing, and maybe wobbly old men like me shouldn’t be gracing SUP racing anyhow. A teenager who’d grown up with SUP would be unstoppable on a board like this. Maybe it’s time the old farts were culled from SUP racing, and this would be an excellent start along that road.

It sure is a lovely looking board, and it’s great to see the rounded hull concept back again. This is the sort of board that would break records on the non-stop 11 Cities race, for instance, with the right rider on top.

photofr

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #157 on: February 25, 2018, 03:24:41 AM »
@AREA51
If you and I had a single task: to come up with a "revolutionary" board that would meet the needs of older paddlers, even brand new to the sport of SUP, would you not agree that a board could look like this:

Nose level: cut the water like a knife
Tail level: close the water with grace
Stability: 27" width behind the feet to ensure narrow catch
Hull level: rounded for the most speed or flat for the most amount of stability
Directional: simply place a rudder and solve it all
Weight level: under 10 kilos - even at 18 feet in length

A well designed board like the above one (or even similar) would have old folks having tons of fun racing around the younger crowd.

After playing with fins, I plan on using my 23" Nelo board until my legs can't take it, and then I plan on on biking to build more leg muscles BEFORE retiring to more stable crafts.

FYI
I don't know if you tried the Maliko fin, but ads an amazing amount of stability. Speed decrease is truly minimal. The JL fin (HUGE MONSTER THING) has more stability, but heck, it's slow as mollasses.
Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #158 on: February 25, 2018, 03:50:06 AM »
It’s also worth noting that for me personally, the tiger is no faster than the Maliko. It’s good for speed but also scaling fin to paddler torque output.

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #159 on: February 25, 2018, 04:23:04 AM »
It is true that you need to match fin to the paddler. But in flat water that is usually dealt better with increasing the length of the base than the depth of the fin.

I have more fins than I care to think about. Embarrassingly large numbers. The Maliko (which I have, of course) is a similar design to several, and is IMO a design that doesn’t solve any particular issue. Plus it is crazy heavy and crazy expensive. In flat water you wouldn’t be measurably slower with the cheapo plastic FCS touring fin in my experience. I’ve got the FCS II Kalama fin on order so I’ll let you know how that is when it arrives. It looks a fairly sensible fin for you heavy pounders, and you can just swap it in and out in seconds.

The VMG Blades Mako 37 is a fast fin in flat water, I find. Maybe you’d have to step up to the 44 if you are a really big dude, but actually I could do with a slightly smaller version of the 37.

The SIC carbon weedless fins are a very good fast all-round design. You’d be welcome to try mine ukgm: I have three of the 8.3” versions but don’t use any of them! Instead I use the 7.0 which is plenty area for me. But I’ve only got 2 of those: they proved so popular that Europe sold out of them very quickly last time they were available. The new RS comes with the 8.3” unfortunately - too big for me but maybe perfect for ukgm and his “paddle steamer on turbo” stroke power :)

You really should be aiming to use the smallest fin you can get away with in flat water.

One of the things that I’ve used in my custom UL is a 2+1 setup where the sides have no toe or cant. This improved the flat water speed very noticeably. I run little 50-50 trailer fins in them in flat water but if you are a heavy hitter you could use some 50/50 foil quad rears (which is what I use for downwind). supuk and I have come up with a specific fin design for this setup, and I’m waiting for him to make them. But unfortunately the material he got sent to make them out of turned out not to be suitable. So it’s on his very long list of things to do.

But if you took an old board to supuk he could fit the same finbox setup that I asked for, and you could try it out. If you fit futures boxes you can use blanking strips to fill them if you don’t like it, so there’s nothing much lost except the cost of the experiment. But you will like it. Using one big deep single fin is sooo 2016 ;) :)

photofr

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #160 on: February 25, 2018, 04:33:49 AM »
Not to make this about fins, but worth noting to viewers & people thinking about MORE FINS:
I love my Tiger fin - it's been my favorite goto fin, and the only I used for nearly 18 months. But here's the problem: fins must be adapted to the person's weight, stroke type, the board you use, AND the conditions you paddle in.

To my great surprise, as a blunt example (and remember that my Tiger fin has been my goto fin), that fin is WORTHLESS for the following application: my 135 pounds - on the Ace 14x25 - on flatwater.

Bottom line, try a friend's new fin on your board based on the conditions you enjoy most. I think everyone should go with the smallest fin they can get by without loosing too much stability & too much tracking.
Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #161 on: February 25, 2018, 04:37:30 AM »
PS: ukgm if you wanted to see what size fin fits you best, I have 3 different sizes of the Futures Triangle Cutaway you could try. Then you remove the variables of construction and design from the equation.

Oh and btw I made a mistake with the VMG Mako sizing above. It’s the 35 I like, not the 37. IMO if you need to go above 40 sq ins in a single fin for pure flatwater then you probably need to be looking either at your technique, or get a board that suits you better (or both).

Downwind is another matter altogether, and the fin design should be completely different IMO. Having said that, I was paddling (UW, DW, crosswind) in very rippy 20-25 knot confused sea yesterday on my SIC RS and had a fin with area of only 34sq ins and I wouldn’t have needed a bigger fin, it felt pretty much perfect, and the narrow base helped going crosswind a lot.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2018, 05:39:58 AM by Area 10 »

Area 10

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #162 on: February 25, 2018, 05:50:20 AM »
...and let’s not forget that at the 2016 ISA World championships in Fiji, Casper Steinfath won the technical race on a fin with area of only 28 sq ins. And he will generate more power at the blade than any of us.

I get the feeling that, as with paddle blades, the trend is to be going smaller.


FloridaWindSUP

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #163 on: February 25, 2018, 05:56:26 AM »
Going from 8.9 kph average on the AllStar to 9.3 kph average on the new board sounds very impressive.

It those kinds of gains are typical, then this rounder hull design might really catch on. Looks similar to the soft-railed NSP dugouts. Wonder how it compares with them in terms of shape details and speed.
14x23 Riviera RP
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mr_proper

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #164 on: February 25, 2018, 06:58:00 AM »
Some pictures from paddling today













SIC RS 14x23, 2018
SIC RS 14x26, 2018
Lightcorp Signature Race 14x24.75, 2018 (sold)
JP Australia AdventurAir 12x36, 2017
Starboard Allstar 14x24.5, 2017 (sold)
SIC Bullet 14x27.25 TWC, 2015
Jimmy Lewis Sidewinder 14x25, 2016 (sold)
Sprint 14x23, 2015 (sold)
JL Stiletto 14x28, 2014 (sold)

 


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