Author Topic: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?  (Read 98676 times)

Eagle

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #315 on: August 17, 2017, 11:51:00 AM »
I'd sure like to try the 21.5 Sprint in a flatwater race.

And I'd like to know if the loss of stability going from the 2016 to the 2017 AllStar has been put back into the 2018 AllStar.

And I'd like to get some unbiased testers' opinion on that "2-3 board lengths faster every 50 strokes" statement about the 2018 AllStar.

This is what SB actually says.  Still quite a statement but not 2 or 3 board lengths.  Am used to now SB making claims year to year -> then kinda going back to something else.  A little flip here -> a little flop there.  Like 2017 deeper concave is better -> to now saying shallow is better.  Even still 2/3 of a board length is still a bold statement and SB should back that up with some independently validated test results.  Would not hold your breath.
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Eagle

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #316 on: August 17, 2017, 12:26:15 PM »
What SB says however about fin tips is valid ie. Race Ultra does have greater stability than the more maneuverable Natural Winner.  Plus a wider side plane should improve stability that the chamfered edges took away for 2017.  Notice also the chamfered rails now increase maneuverability vs adding stability like stated in 2017.  Hmm?  We find testing OTW dispels any rumors or speculation inaccuracies or marketing hype or bs after just a minute or so.  ;)
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ukgm

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #317 on: August 18, 2017, 01:39:45 AM »
I'd sure like to try the 21.5 Sprint in a flatwater race.

And I'd like to know if the loss of stability going from the 2016 to the 2017 AllStar has been put back into the 2018 AllStar.

And I'd like to get some unbiased testers' opinion on that "2-3 board lengths faster every 50 strokes" statement about the 2018 AllStar.

This is what SB actually says.  Still quite a statement but not 2 or 3 board lengths.  Am used to now SB making claims year to year -> then kinda going back to something else.  A little flip here -> a little flop there.  Like 2017 deeper concave is better -> to now saying shallow is better.  Even still 2/3 of a board length is still a bold statement and SB should back that up with some independently validated test results.  Would not hold your breath.

They won't do that. I've suggested it to a few brands as a marketing strapline but there is a feeling that (even with these race boards) that art and emotion is more attractive than science and hard numbers. (By the way, my own testing has been peer reviewed and is in press to be published in a scientific journal before years end.)

(By the way Eagle, I've just had a secondhand 2017 24.5 Allstar delivered for me to test).
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 01:50:08 AM by ukgm »

ukgm

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #318 on: August 18, 2017, 01:42:02 AM »
The 22.5 Allstar is beyond me but a very interesting prospect for racing. You're getting a very narrow profile there that can handle messier water. That sounds a like a good racing option for most estuary/calm open water/flatwater races to me.

Eagle

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #319 on: August 18, 2017, 08:45:08 AM »
I know that 24.5AS quite well.  Will be interesting to hear your comments after testing.  Was not exactly my cup of tea nor sized correctly for me -> but can understand its appeal for certain top racers.  For me it felt like a big big volume board vs my very low slung 23.

But still my pref would be Sprint 23 or 21.5 for flatwater vs an AS22.5 any day.  Thos 2 boards feel like custom made for me.  The sharp nose design of the Sprint is simply perfection for flat.  The splashy AS has a bit too much rocker to be really efficient me thinks.  But no doubt it is fast as FWS has demonstrated -> just the Sprint is simply faster and has mega glide efficiency.

My take is the 2016 AS23 and 2017 Sprint 21.5 designs were done right as is.  No need to deviate from those proven race concepts.  But fully understand SB tweaks year to year in their quest to sell "new" boards in hopes of generating profits.
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ukgm

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #320 on: August 18, 2017, 09:36:07 AM »
I know that 24.5AS quite well.  Will be interesting to hear your comments after testing.  Was not exactly my cup of tea nor sized correctly for me -> but can understand its appeal for certain top racers.  For me it felt like a big big volume board vs my very low slung 23.

But still my pref would be Sprint 23 or 21.5 for flatwater vs an AS22.5 any day.  Thos 2 boards feel like custom made for me.  The sharp nose design of the Sprint is simply perfection for flat.  The splashy AS has a bit too much rocker to be really efficient me thinks.

Well I put a couple of hours tempo paddle on it today and obliterated my upstream and downstream training time records so it got a thumbs up from me. I found it initially a bit wobbly due to most of my last boards being far higher in primary stability. However, once I'd put 10 mins in and learned to trust the secondary stability, I was really impressed. The nose splash isn't pretty and it isn't great upwind but the higher volume suited me. It's also the narrowest width I've ever paddled in anger so I was amazed I could just jump on it and go at full power. I'd be tempted to try the 23 too.

I also agree the sprints would obviously be faster in a straight line in isolation but most domestic races aren't in clean or virgin water and you need something that can handle a little more chaos on most of our start lines. As a result, I think a AS 22.5 may well be an attractive option for some medium weight paddlers. If I were buying from new for 2018 and going to use everywhere, the 23.5 would be very tempting.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 09:39:33 AM by ukgm »

Eagle

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #321 on: August 18, 2017, 10:38:31 AM »
Yeah that triple concave design seems to work ok.  But my guess is that you will sink the 23 more than optimal.  Had a heavier guy on my 2016 AS23 last night and it looked like the board was sitting too low.  He was very unstable on it and could not even stand upright.  He has tried twice now.  An older gent -> but has been paddling SUP and surfski for years.  I raced him last year on my Touring Pin while he used his very heavy ocean racing scull -> and simply could not catch him.  He is probs 15 years my senior and very competitive.  Haha!  He likes challenging our Olympian Eights guy who still rows almost daily in all conditions.

But SB adding more volume to give the 2017 AS more pop in waves vs spearing like my iteration -> was the right move from a racing perspective.  Do know what you mean about wash and mass starts.  So certainly understand the concern.  But if you can pull away from that mess in shape and dry -> you should place high on say a 25 Sprint.

Would suspect you should try the 2018 AS23.5 if the 24.5 feels ok and you are setting training PRs.  Makes sense the 2018 with that flattened tail should stabilize the initial tip more and be even easier to handle for you.  The narrowing width was a big noticeable speed factor for me.  Imagine going full out like Connor and Boothy on a 21.5 spear.  Big big speed.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 10:42:24 AM by Eagle »
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Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Eagle

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #322 on: August 18, 2017, 11:35:59 AM »
Actually an impromptu race with the Olympian was the hardest race I have ever paddled as we were neck and neck for 2 miles until he finally gassed.  I could not believe he could maintain pace and technique and keep up while I was on my Dom while he was on his rough ocean rowing scull.  He is at least 50 lbs heavier and out of shape.  Amazing these older guys that have an elite high level training background are so impressive.  So can understand why someone like 50+ fit and trim Larry can smoke most younger racers in Chattajack etc.  With pro level technique -> these guys actually do pull like monsters.  ;)

http://www.chattajack.com/course-records
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

 


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