Author Topic: Shaping Stand Dimensions  (Read 8585 times)

PonoBill

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Shaping Stand Dimensions
« on: May 20, 2017, 09:57:42 AM »
I have a new tube bender that I got to rebuild the roll cage on my Ambro. Before I start bending a lot of super-expensive 1.5" .120 wall DOM tubing and even more expensive Chrome moly I got 20 feet of welded seam .120 wall to make sure I can bend and fabricate to tolerance. It's still 60 bucks worth of tubing, so I might as well make something useful with it. I'm thinking Shaping stand. Bend two identical board supports with some degree of precision, and then practice both my notching and welding skills to add the base. Now the question is how deep, how wide the throat should be, and how high the working height. I could guess, but since part of this exercise is working to specifications, it would be nice to have some measurements to start with. Your assistance would be appreciated.

My Tig welding has advanced tremendously over the last two weeks at the cost of a lot of filler rod, $263 worth of Argon, and about 300 coupons, tubing bits, angles, plates and odd shapes in steel, aluminum, stainless, copper and brass (I never thought of welding copper before--welds great), as well as a few holes in clothing and subsequent hopping around cursing violently. I've welded for fifty years, but this is the first time I've ever been serious about doing it well. Very satisfying.  Very time consuming, but worth it.

In the unlikely event you are in the market for a great tube bender, the JD Squared 32 is simply awesome. I've used expensive hydraulic benders before. This one is manual, but it permits better control and makes perfect un-kinked bends in thin or thick wall tubing. You'd think manual bending  a thick wall 2" tube would be impossible, but it's actually quite easy and precise. The bender is cheap ($300), the dies are expensive (about $300 each) but nothing like big hydraulic benders that start at 5K and head north fast.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 10:05:05 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

jrandy

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2017, 11:46:15 AM »
Hi Bill,
Ah welding...25 years ago I was doing it all day long on mild steel and worked with guys who were artists with TIG on stainless.

Here is a picture of 2 of my stands.

-The left one is about 35" high, holds a surfboard 4.5" thick x 13" deep on rail. I remember either lowering or raising this set once.
-The right one is a glassing stand 36" tall with an outrigger arm to hold big 31" wide SUP's on rail,  9" thick x 20" deep.
-The project on the floor back is a PD Racer. It's supposed to get wet in 13 days. If I get the bow on today I can bent the bottom plywood tomorrow and glass the corners next week.

I am 6' 3" for reference. I would heft your biggest power tool related to surfboards (like a Rockwell 653 planer or Milwaukee sander) and hold it where you want to work and go from there.

I have ideas to make a glassing stand that I can kick a lever and it raises another 12 or 18"  so I can tuck the laps without bending so far over. I have a donor stand with wheels, just need to figure out the action.

Edit: Greenlight's shaping stand plans: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0689/1441/files/build-a-surfboard-shaping-rack_634360b1-c14a-4376-a5cc-a4bf19c500df.pdf?16216708058669744041
« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 11:57:27 AM by jrandy »
http://pushheretosavealife.com/
Be safe, have fun. -J

supuk

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2017, 02:40:18 PM »
A raising glassing rack has been on my list for a long time but quite a tricky project to get right especially on a sup scale. It could defiantly use a few bent tubes though to make some sort of cam

TallDude

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2017, 07:26:07 PM »
Danny Brawner was helping me glas my unlimited, and he's about 6'4. He commented on liking how high I made my stands. He said he always wished they had glassing stands with hydrolic lifts. It would make glassing a lot easier on his back.
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

surfinib

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2017, 08:12:28 PM »
Pono, round tubing leaves less surface area for the blank to rest on. I find that I get bruises on EPS blanks when using my stand made from 2" tubing, even with a couple of layers of 1" padding. I've changed out to a 3" flat surface stand which evens out the pressure.

TallDude

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2017, 08:45:12 PM »
I just use little peices of soft foam taped on either end of my shaping stand. I cover the carpet on my shaping stands with a plastic bag, then tape the little peices of soft foam over the plastic. The foam holds it about an 1" above the plastic bag.
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

PonoBill

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2017, 09:19:18 AM »
Thanks all, i knew i could count on you. A raiing stand is a geat idea. 1.5 in tube telescopes into 1.5 pipe. I could use chair lifters with pins fot positive setting. Will do. 
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

PonoBill

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2017, 01:30:05 PM »
Pleased to say i cant type well on my phone.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

supuk

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2017, 01:16:13 AM »
was trawling bangood and came across these which may work good for the adjustable glassing stand idea.

https://www.banggood.com/750N-12V-24681012-inch-Linear-Actuator-Adjustable-Actuator-Tor-Opener-Linear-Actuator-Motor-p-1110373.html?rmmds=category

PonoBill

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2017, 07:08:05 AM »
Those are very interesting, and the price is great, but it seems unnecessarily complicated. I considered some chair lifters, but it seems that just telescoping legs with pins to lock at various heights would be fine since I'd still be raising the stand pedestals one at a time with no fine control ability to control the movement--I could easily drop a board off the stand. Hmmm...that said I can see the benefit of changing the height with synchronized linear actuators. It would be quite simple to make both pedestals rise together with a board on them and then be able to fine tune each pedestal height. The capacity of the linear actuators (750n) would make pins unnecessary. Okay, I talked myself into it. Thank you.

Interesting that the actuators are rated in newtons instead of kilograms, but of course it makes sense to use force units. I am SO pissed that the USA didn't see the change to metric all the way through. We cripple ourselves using archaic, arbitrary units of measure. Force units in the English scale are slugs. No one but engineers ever use it or even know what it means. So even just conceptually, the average American doesn't separate force from weight. We speak of foot-pounds of force, which is an inaccurate concept in many situations. Fractional math instead of decimal, wire gauge different from sheet metal gauge, drill sizes in numbers, then letters, then fractions as size increases. Ugh.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Bean

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2017, 08:01:50 AM »
I love the fact that I have to have at least two complete sets of mechanics tools, SAE and Metric.  It really is convenient, just last week I misplaced my 1/2" socket so I simply grabbed a 13mm. 

In any event here are some simple plans for a shaping stand from Greenlight Surf Supply (NJ):

https://greenlightsurfsupply.com/pages/greenlight-surfboard-building-guide-a-z.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0689/1441/files/build-a-surfboard-shaping-rack.pdf?367
« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 08:07:03 AM by Bean »

PonoBill

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2017, 09:28:16 AM »
My new shaping/glassing stand is all TIGged up and ready for any 500 pound board I want to shape on it. It's mostly a practice exercise for using my new tube bender and welding tubing. I'm going to rework the roll cage on my Ambro. Waiting for the linear actuators to vary the height for shaping and glassing. It too high and the rac on surfer's left is higher than the right, but that's easy. My wife said the welding looks good--makes me want to puke. I'm trying to keep the weld a consistent width and finish smoothly. Not easy. I keep pulling the filler rod out of the argon stream and contaminating it, and at the end of a weld I'm supposed to start decreasing the amps, feed one drop of filler, and cut off current as soon as it goes flat. My finishes have either a blob or a divot. Damn. But I'll get there.




« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 10:26:27 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

blueplanetsurf

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2017, 10:04:32 AM »
The stands look great, nice work, the height adjustability is a nice touch.  I am a little concerned about the size of the buckets you used though.  The footprint seems pretty small, especially if you are working on a wider board.  If the board is slightly off center and you are applying pressure it could tip or be unstable.
Robert Stehlik
Blue Planet Surf Shop, Honolulu
Hawaii's SUP HQ
http://www.blueplanetsurf.com

PonoBill

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2017, 10:15:22 AM »
Thanks for the observation Robert, I'll screw some plywood bases to the buckets.

This shot is evened up and shortened up, but probably not enough. I think I might need to take it down to sawhorse height. the linear actuators I'm waiting for will raise it 12 inches. Unlike other materials, it's not all that hard to add length, but it's still easier to shorten them. Anyone have any suggestions for lowest height? I've shrunk to 6'1 and my most comfortable tool level is low waist level--about 32 inches. With typical board 3+ or more thickness that suggests 29". I'm going to screw 1/2" plywood flats on the horizontal tubes and hot glue some 1" EPS construction foam on them to prevent blank denting per surfinib's suggestion. So maybe 27.5" which makes raised level 37.5" for working laps.That's maybe a little low with my creaky back. I build all my workbenches at 39"


« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 10:21:57 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

supuk

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Re: Shaping Stand Dimensions
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2017, 11:42:00 AM »
Looking good, but I have to say if your ever going to want to shape anything on them you will want them on a much more solid base or even bolted to the floor. If not a tube that at least holds the two together as a wobbly stand makes it take twice as long and almost imposable to shape accurately. look forward to seeing how the actuators go.

I have ended up building the most expensive glassing racks in the world here but it would be very easy to fit actuators to the adjustable height mechanism.

 


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