Author Topic: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]  (Read 344487 times)

Weasels wake

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #600 on: February 22, 2017, 08:46:39 AM »


So it begins. And so ends logical intelligent discussion.
Just now?
It takes a quiver to do that.

yugi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #601 on: February 22, 2017, 08:50:50 AM »
The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.  It speaks about a specific change "the cynical use of ‘us vs them’ narratives of blame, hate and fear took on a global prominence to a level not seen since the 1930s", yet there is no significant historical perspective, only net-opinion.

Yugi, tell me how the AI report supports the shift from 1930 to present.

Bean, you wrote “The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.”. Their annual report is based on research.

Get real, mate. For comments the Secretary General of Amnesty International made in the release statement of the report, no, I’m not responsible for backing up why he said that. Ask him yourself. 

If you wish to have an intelligent respectful discussion with me on why I find his points valid, or point out to me useful information on why I shouldn’t, OK. We can do that but without the twisty tactics. Else I’m out.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2017, 09:22:59 AM by yugi »

SUPcheat

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #602 on: February 22, 2017, 09:39:56 AM »
Why waste time with logical and intelligent discussion when you can have an ad hominem screaming match?
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PonoBill

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #603 on: February 22, 2017, 09:58:43 AM »
I'm not particularly concerned with the administration, though it's certainly a shitshow of epic proportions. I'm far more concerned that there is so much polarization of opinion regarding governance, and how people should behave, and intervention, and immigration, and basic things I'd call humanity.

I'm not sure where all this comes from, maybe it's always been there and the web has simply given it a voice. Looking at responses in a political site, or on youtube, or anywhere almost gives me a sick feeling and a serious case of the willies. Add in religious intolerance and the antics of a reality TV spoiled brat fade away for me.

It's a lousy time for all this. The world is changing very quickly, and politics and it's connection to religion is where change gets regulated. More than any other factor, that's where I see the future of the USA dimming rapidly. Populist politics puts the stupid and gullible in charge, and I don't mean Trump. I mean all the idiots, left and right, who are too stupid to doubt their convictions.
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Bean

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #604 on: February 22, 2017, 10:11:41 AM »
The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.  It speaks about a specific change "the cynical use of ‘us vs them’ narratives of blame, hate and fear took on a global prominence to a level not seen since the 1930s", yet there is no significant historical perspective, only net-opinion.

Yugi, tell me how the AI report supports the shift from 1930 to present.

Bean, you wrote “The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.”. Their annual report is based on research.


That's just it Yugi, I did not find that opinion supported in the annual report.  It's not so much whether I agree or disagree, it's the quality and credibility of the data that's being thrown around on all sides that should have us all concerned.

headmount

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #605 on: February 22, 2017, 10:30:49 AM »
I'm not particularly concerned with the administration, though it's certainly a shitshow of epic proportions. I'm far more concerned that there is so much polarization of opinion regarding governance, and how people should behave, and intervention, and immigration, and basic things I'd call humanity.

I'm not sure where all this comes from, maybe it's always been there and the web has simply given it a voice. Looking at responses in a political site, or on youtube, or anywhere almost gives me a sick feeling and a serious case of the willies. Add in religious intolerance and the antics of a reality TV spoiled brat fade away for me.

It's a lousy time for all this. The world is changing very quickly, and politics and it's connection to religion is where change gets regulated. More than any other factor, that's where I see the future of the USA dimming rapidly. Populist politics puts the stupid and gullible in charge, and I don't mean Trump. I mean all the idiots, left and right, who are too stupid to doubt their convictions.
Eric Sevaried essentially said the same thing back when we were growing up.  "Better to trust the man who is frequently in error than the one who is never in doubt."  He also said, “The biggest big business in America is not steel, automobiles, or television. It is the manufacture, refinement and distribution of anxiety.”

johnysmoke

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #606 on: February 22, 2017, 11:22:06 AM »
Good quotes headmount.
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Bean

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #607 on: February 22, 2017, 12:50:56 PM »
The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.  It speaks about a specific change "the cynical use of ‘us vs them’ narratives of blame, hate and fear took on a global prominence to a level not seen since the 1930s", yet there is no significant historical perspective, only net-opinion.
Yugi, tell me how the AI report supports the shift from 1930 to present.

Bean, you wrote “The problem with the AI report is that it is pure opinion.”. Their annual report is based on research...

Yugi, by now you have undoubtedly read the entire annual report (409 pages) and have seen for yourself that the quote, "the cynical use of ‘us vs them’ narratives of blame, hate and fear took on a global prominence to a level not seen since the 1930s" is nowhere to be found within the report.  And certainly not based on research as you had said.

So, if there is no relevance, why does Salil Shetty make reference the 1930's in his quote?  I see this simply as classic fear-mongering.

Stay skeptical my friend, even if it's AI...

lucabrasi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #608 on: February 22, 2017, 01:35:30 PM »
........ I'm far more concerned that there is so much polarization of opinion regarding governance, and how people should behave, and intervention, and immigration, and basic things I'd call humanity.

I'm not sure where all this comes from, maybe it's always been there and the web has simply given it a voice. Looking at responses in a political site, or on youtube, or anywhere almost gives me a sick feeling and a serious case of the willies. Add in religious intolerance and the antics of a reality TV spoiled brat fade away for me.

It's a lousy time for all this. The world is changing very quickly..............
I think it's always been there but now the internet has given everyone a voice and social media has made that voice louder. The ability to stay anything from autonomous to anonymous just really opens the jar of bad behaivor along with being able to be heard. "Hey, someone is listening to me.....that's never happened......."  Well, it's a good thing we don't really know what kind of person you are but the one you are presenting yourself as sure does say alot and in many cases it's probably a damn good thing no one has listened before. The opinions have probably always been there to a point but the constant oneupmanship that the internet and especially social media or the comment sections of things just really sets it all free. Plenty of dimwits in all flavors to go around, lots of bandwagon jumpers as well as always has been but if you were to actually have a conversation with people then I don't think people would be so...........antisocial? I don't know.
I also don't see this place as being that way even tho we are all somewhat autonomous or anonymous to a degree. Is it because a forum lends itself to a more social atmosphere? Should twitter and maybe even facebook be defined more as antisocial media? I guess in its inception and plan facebook would be social media but it seems to lend itself the exact opposite of that more so I think in many ways. Comment sections? That's just a shitshow but rather entertaining none the less.

Eric Sevaried. I too young to remember him as much more than the guy who seemed to do the evening news on the weekends or fill in when Walter was off but he also said this I just saw. Seems I have looked him up over the past couple years another time or few as well.
"Next to power without honor, the most dangerous thing in the world is power without humor."
Uh-oh.

Amnesty International. What is that place? I am sure way good intentions. What happens with the research? What is the research? Is it someones....mullings over events and press in the world? Not much different than what you and me are doing trying to figure out what the hell is going on?
Someone looks at it.....dissolves it and.....How can it be deemed the truth rather than an opinion I guess would be my question. (No.....I didn't read much on that particular piece.)
   
Which tribe was it? The Nez Perce? No words for me, I, myself, etc in their language. I can't remember which one nor am I certain if that is true or rumor but sure sounds good.

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Watching that.........damn if we haven't been here before.

Hell with it.
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yugi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #609 on: February 22, 2017, 01:56:45 PM »
...

Yugi, by now you have undoubtedly read the entire annual report (409 pages) and have seen for yourself that the quote, "the cynical use of ‘us vs them’ narratives of blame, hate and fear took on a global prominence to a level not seen since the 1930s" is nowhere to be found within the report.  And certainly not based on research as you had said.

So, if there is no relevance, why does Salil Shetty make reference the 1930's in his quote?  I see this simply as classic fear-mongering.

Stay skeptical my friend, even if it's AI...

I full-heartedly agree it’s best to check sources.

Take it up with Shetty by all means if you think a part of his statement was a bit loose. Or enlighten us if you know better or otherwise.

I’m no historian. The part that’s gotten your knickers in a twist didn’t bother me. I found other parts of the message more interesting. But I’d love to learn something.

Amnesty International is in the business of publishing very provocative stuff so I’d expect them to be very used to be fact checked when they publish something. I’m sure they are very open to feedback especially if you feel they could use correcting.

I haven’t finished reading every word just yet. You’ll have my report on your desk in the morning, sir.

Bean

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #610 on: February 22, 2017, 03:20:37 PM »
The part that’s gotten your knickers in a twist didn’t bother me.

Of course not, that "part" is strictly anecdotal.  It's the underlying message that's of concern.  There is a misleading inference, a corollary of the rise of fascism in the middle 30's to current events. 

Weasels wake

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #611 on: February 22, 2017, 05:13:02 PM »
The part that’s gotten your knickers in a twist didn’t bother me.

Of course not, that "part" is strictly anecdotal.  It's the underlying message that's of concern.  There is a misleading inference, a corollary of the rise of fascism in the middle 30's to current events.
People who shout fascism, Hitler, and Nazi, these days, are who now make up the alt-left.  Check out Sunsara Taylor, there are clips of her on YouTube, yikes, her brains are on fire, alt-left all the way.
I want no part of the alt-right or alt-left, and I think and hope that people are getting tired of all that, it's getting old, very old, and the more they keep it up, the worse it will be, primarily for them.  Cooler heads usually prevail, in this country anyway.
It takes a quiver to do that.

stoneaxe

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #612 on: February 22, 2017, 06:02:48 PM »
Spot on bro. I fear the screaming more than anything.
Bob

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lucabrasi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #613 on: February 22, 2017, 07:42:58 PM »
Check out Sunsara Taylor, there are clips of her on YouTube, yikes, her brains are on fire, alt-left all the way.
hahahahhaha. What have I been missing? Holy cow. For reals? Wow.
There's people out there like that and I guess there always has been but now it's easier to get a bit of exposure tho her twitter doesn't look like it got enough people following for how busy she is with it.

stoneaxe

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Bob

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